Government pressuring Media to discredit WikiLeaks.org ???

Posted: November 29, 2010 in Helping Hands Events, Secrets, Table Of Contents, TRUTH / Occupy
Tags: , , , , , , , , , , ,

Over history government officials have had to make difficult decisions which are not in agreement with the majority vote of the people which they represent.

We THE PEOPLE, fight amongst ourselves over what is right and wrong, true and false; but the fact remains, WE ARE FREE and WE should respect our neighbors as we respect ourselves. When discussing major political actions with our friends and family, we should always ask first, is this action what we would want our neighbor to do to us.

The focus of this blog is not to study the past wrongs of the United States government but I can not avoid citing some of the invasions of others free lands every time this topic comes up. Do you want another countries military driving their tanks on your front yard? Do you want them to move in to your home or take control of your business to setup their base camps? It goes on and on but that is what happens when a foreign military invades it’s neighbor. The soldiers have to stay somewhere.

SURE, IN EXTREME cases where another foreign power is invading a 3rd party country FIRST and committing heinous genocide war crimes, the humane thing to do is go and rescue innocent victims and then evacuate immediately after obtaining stability, only to leave behind small platoons to protect for a maximum of a few months after the last shot is fired.

In the beginning, only neighbors fought wars and those from far away lands kept their violence in their own back yard. There was no giant collision of ALL countries on one land until long distant weapons were created. Even when it was just boats with cannons through the 1800s, the battles were contained to a few dominant powers. After the shots were done being fired the land was left to an independent government and a new nation would be formed.

The point is, in the past our country has invaded lands like Hawaii for our own benefit. Our government would use the media to convince the people that the Political opinion was best. The US government supported the businessmen whom over threw the Hawaiin council in 1893 and then strategically placed their associates in key locations throughout the islands to operate new businesses. We were told that this had to be done to secure lookout stations in Pan Pacific for the West Coast of the US so the Japanese and Chinese could not setup bases there.

http://whatreallyhappened.com/WRHARTICLES/HAWAII/leonsiu/2%20Misconceptions.htm

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Example 1. Pearl Harbor 12/7/41

Over the years the US government controlled the Islands to make sure they were available come a time they wanted to invade Asian powers. FDR and his supporters wanted more power in Europe but the people and congress denied his attempts to expand so FDR decided to provoke Japan by sending them threats. If he could get approval to attack Japan, then he could send more troops into Western Europe once they got involved.

What is most important about the Pearl Harbor incident is understanding why FDR resorted to such measures in the first place to get into war.

Congress was not letting FDR get into the war in Europe or the Pacific. This is partly because many of the members of Congress were backed by wealthy Americans who were working with the fascist powers of Europe. America had significant financial ties to the fascist powers at the time of WWII, and the European fascists were backed by private Americans as an anti-Communist force. In addition to these facts the general American population was ill informed about what was going on in Europe and a significant anti-war movement had taken hold in America because America had just come off of a 30 year imperialist military streak that had given Americans negative feelings about American military actions.

http://rationalrevolution.net/war/fdr_provoked_the_japanese_attack.htm

The only way FDR could get his way was to provoke casualties of war on Pearl Harbor by the Japanese and then retaliate… which is why warnings from communication cryptographers to the Military were silenced and no notice was sent to our families at Pearl Harbor. No large airforce could invade our base with no notice, without help from our own defense.

http://www.independent.org/newsroom/article.asp?id=1930

“Because American cryptographers had also broken the Japanese naval code, the leaders in Washington knew as well that Japan’s “measures” would include an attack on Pearl Harbor.[4] Yet they withheld this critical information from the commanders in Hawaii, who might have headed off the attack or prepared themselves to defend against it. That Roosevelt and his chieftains did not ring the tocsin makes perfect sense: after all, the impending attack constituted precisely what they had been seeking for a long time. As Stimson confided to his diary after a meeting of the war cabinet on November 25, “The question was how we should maneuver them [the Japanese] into firing the first shot without allowing too much danger to ourselves.”[5] After the attack, Stimson confessed that “my first feeling was of relief … that a crisis had come in a way which would unite all our people.[6]”

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I will publish a special focus follow up on many more examples like 911 but for right now, the crucial action at hand is the censorship of true patriots fighting for our freedom on OUR OWN SOIL where they belong and where the REAL FIGHT IS. Soldiers like those at WikiLeaks.org need your support so forward the link to this blog and their links below. Repost them on your sites and get busy tweeting…. we beg you.

TAKE SOME TIME right now please and browse the WIKIleaks.org site before it is completely censored by our Chinese wanna be government censoring officials.

Protect your freedom of speech and fight media censorship for the love of all that is good.

http://twitter.com/#!/wikileaks

http://news.cnet.com/8301-1023_3-20023932-93.html?part=rss&subj=news&tag=2547-1_3-0-20

 

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

(Comparing the US to China is only in reference to our internet and information being censored like it is there. A true dictatorship controls what knowledge the people are able to obtain and thus, the are not truely free.)

 

HIGHLIGHT COMMENT THREAD:

 

Mike Sullivan November 28 at 7:29pm:

Hell no I won’t browse it. For one, it’s illegal to do so on these government computers–it’ll “classify” the machine and we can lose it. For another, we (anyone without the need to know) have no business looking at classified documents…period. It’s not conspiracy…it’s not censorship…it’s not even “freedom of speech”! It’s a matter of life and death for our soldiers, sailors, marines, and airmen whose names and and very lives are endangered by those documents!

 

? November 28 at 7:42pm:

AMEN

Mike, I agree with you 95%. classified documents are classified for a reason. This is going to do way more harm than good and people will suffer from it.

Tim, I’m sorry brother but you DO NOT have a right to know much of this information. And trust me when I tell you that this is not a conspiracy.

 

 

? November 28 at 7:49pm:

Also, when does the media have the right to release classified documents? Just because the info was leaked by some little traitor punk in the Army doesn’t give everyone the right to know. This is empowering our enemies! People that want you dead, Tim! People that we in the armed forces are trying to subdue so you can go about voicing your opinions so freely.

 

 

 

? November 28 at 8:22pm

One more thing, Tim. If at any point I thought my government was getting anywhere close to how China runs it’s country and treats it’s people I would be out of the military in a heart beat.

 

 

Tim Frentz 9:13pm

My family is largely military so my opinions are not coming from the other side of the fence.

 

The debate is the content. Provide me a couple links from the site via private message (if you are so convinced you not need to have more people be…come aware of it by pasting on this thread) where you see content that qualifies as life threatening to a soldier alive in a war zone territory that is not currently secure and “safe” in a neutral zone.

 

It is a side note, but our internet content is becoming more and more censored every day since the passing of the law to allow unlimited corporate spending on campaigns. It has free’d up companies with the most money to play dirty. They are paying content providers to slow down the websites of their competitors in certain markets which results in errors similar to “website not found” etc.

 

There are many examples of this so take 5 minutes and read the following in regards to my censorship comment.

 

http://measurementlab.net/resources (this provides scientific data, tools and results etc.)

 

http://savetheinternet.com/ (the hub for Internet Freedom / Net Neutrality Forums)

 

Spend some time and provide sources to support your opinion please, that is all I ask. I hope to see some examples from you that may convince me to apologize for supporting http://WikiLeaks.org/

 

Tim Frentz

Mike – please wait until we conclude our debate to retract support of our charity. I am not firm on supporting wikiLeaks fully until I am done reading the entire site… which I am trying to do right now.

 

So far, it seems like they are just …making the “truth” via documentation available. I try not to support “conspiracy”. I research and look for overwhelming proof before taking a strong stand on anything.

 

You rarely EVER see me stand firmly on politics in a debate because I rarely experience their AFFECTS directly on me or someone in my presence. If I do not witness a crime, I can not fully stand on one side or the other and argue.

 

As I am reading wikiLeaks, I will post updates and cite examples without republishing “delicate” information that may put a life in jeopardy.

 

So start sending me links and help convince me I am wrong….

 

 

Mike Sullivan

I think you need to prove yourself RIGHT before I have to prove you wrong. My “opinion” comes from 16+ years (and counting) in the military—from my various assignments AROUND the world. I may not like or agree with some things that happen… in the US Government, but I took an oath to support and defend the constitution from all enemies, foreign AND domestic.

 

?

Tim, are you honestly going to read the 400,000 plus pages that wikileaks is releasing? I think not. The only proof I need is the word of guys I personally know that had to deal with the last leak and all the problems it caused them. And like Mike said, how about you prove to us that this ISN’T going to cause more harm than good. The burden of proof isn’t on us as we didn’t release this crap.

 

 

Loyed Bburn

How can one defend the constitution then declare an American citizen exercising one of their constitutional guarantees as an enemy? Please clarify as I think all American citizens should be aware of an active duty military member who considers free speech to be qualification for ‘enemy’. … just a passerby citizen in this little conversation 🙂

 

Tim Frentz

fair enough – I will post a review in a few hours — there is a lot of content. Just because you view your military position outside your own countries borders as “ok” does not mean I will “dis friend you”

 

The only people I do not call my f…riends are those that cause direct harm to others be-it direct physical contact, verbal or indirect crimes against the environment to a high level.

 

I will not call someone my enemy because they have an opinion. That makes you an enlightened, educated, sophisticated human being and someone I enjoy having debates like this one with.

 

I have the freedom as a human being NOT AS AN AMERICAN CITIZEN to have the opinion that LARGE AMOUNTS of American military soldiers should only leave our borders to STOP genocide against any living being. Force should not be used for prevention beyond holding small areas for democratic meetings such as Embassy’s and their local protection.

 

We deploy troops, they STOP war crimes with the assistance of UN regulation and leadership, then we vacate in accordance with the return of balance and the new local UN approved indigenous leadership.

 

 

Mike Sullivan

I qualify someone participating in the leaking of classified information as an enemy of the state. What “constitutional guarantee” are you talking about? Freedom of speech? When you become an enemy of the state–you are no longer protected …by the constitution. When freedom of speech–or the exercise of it places you into the category of a spy or collaborator against the government—then yes, this active duty person will consider them an “enemy”.

 

 

Tim Frentz

Help me understand how this has caused a direct problem to your guys. Send to me as a private message if you would prefer. I am evolving and becoming a better human being by this conversation and the assistance of those involved… except those who call me mean names when I have not done so to them. Corry, I love you to man. come on, lets hug it out. My full apology is coming soon but for now, I AM SORRY I HAVE OFFENDED anyone.

 

?

No can do Tim, but maybe what I know will come out in the next leak… I look forward to talking to you in person some day.

 

 

Loyed Bburn

Oh, I know Tim what some of us troops have done to walk the longest mile. That was directed at the active duty military member who said he was considering you as an ‘enemy’. I don’t know this person or you very well, I just see what is writ…ten here and that kinda puts the heeby jeebies even on this vets neck hairs. All earthlings are guaranteed voice at birth, true. America has it written into a piece of paper that specifies it as a rule of governing. Governing translates into military power. When the military starts considering voiced Americans as enemies it’s time to pause a moment and ask a few questions. Dig?

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Comments
  1. Reviewing the WikiLeaks.org Situation

    COMMENT DEBATE:

    TIM FRENTZ OPINION: (before reviewing the data being censored)

    TAKE SOME TIME right now please and browse the WIKIleaks.org site before
    it is completely censored by our Chinese wanna be government officials.

    Protect your freedom of speech and fight media censorship for the love of all that is good.

    http://twitter.com/#!/wikileaks

    http://news.cnet.com/8301-1023_3-20023932-93.html?part=rss&subj=news&tag=2547-1_3-0-20

    (Comparing the US to China is only in reference to our internet and information being censored like it is there. A true dictatorship controls what knowledge the people are able to obtain and thus, the are not truely free.)

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    HIGHLIGHT THREAD:

    Mike Sullivan November 28 at 7:29pm:
    Hell no I won’t browse it. For one, it’s illegal to do so on these government computers–it’ll “classify” the machine and we can lose it. For another, we (anyone without the need to know) have no business looking at classified documents…period. It’s not conspiracy…it’s not censorship…it’s not even “freedom of speech”! It’s a matter of life and death for our soldiers, sailors, marines, and airmen whose names and and very lives are endangered by those documents!

    ? November 28 at 8:22pm
    One more thing, Tim. If at any point I thought my government was getting anywhere close to how China runs it’s country and treats it’s people I would be out of the military in a heart beat.

    Tim Frentz 9:13pm
    My family is largely military so my opinions are not coming from the other side of the fence.

    The debate is the content. Provide me a couple links from the site via private message (if you are so convinced you not need to have more people be…come aware of it by pasting on this thread) where you see content that qualifies as life threatening to a soldier alive in a war zone territory that is not currently secure and “safe” in a neutral zone.

    It is a side note, but our internet content is becoming more and more censored every day since the passing of the law to allow unlimited corporate spending on campaigns. It has free’d up companies with the most money to play dirty. They are paying content providers to slow down the websites of their competitors in certain markets which results in errors similar to “website not found” etc.

    There are many examples of this so take 5 minutes and read the following in regards to my censorship comment.

    http://measurementlab.net/resources (this provides scientific data, tools and results etc.)

    http://savetheinternet.com/ (the hub for Internet Freedom / Net Neutrality Forums)

    Spend some time and provide sources to support your opinion please, that is all I ask. I hope to see some examples from you that may convince me to apologize for supporting http://WikiLeaks.org/

    Tim Frentz
    Mike – please wait until we conclude our debate to retract support of our charity. I am not firm on supporting wikiLeaks fully until I am done reading the entire site… which I am trying to do right now.

    So far, it seems like they are just …making the “truth” via documentation available. I try not to support “conspiracy”. I research and look for overwhelming proof before taking a strong stand on anything.

    You rarely EVER see me stand firmly on politics in a debate because I rarely experience their AFFECTS directly on me or someone in my presence. If I do not witness a crime, I can not fully stand on one side or the other and argue.

    As I am reading wikiLeaks, I will post updates and cite examples without republishing “delicate” information that may put a life in jeopardy.

    So start sending me links and help convince me I am wrong….

    Mike Sullivan
    I think you need to prove yourself RIGHT before I have to prove you wrong. My “opinion” comes from 16+ years (and counting) in the military—from my various assignments AROUND the world. I may not like or agree with some things that happen… in the US Government, but I took an oath to support and defend the constitution from all enemies, foreign AND domestic.

    Loyed Bburn
    How can one defend the constitution then declare an American citizen exercising one of their constitutional guarantees as an enemy? Please clarify as I think all American citizens should be aware of an active duty military member who considers free speech to be qualification for ‘enemy’. … just a passerby citizen in this little conversation 🙂

    Tim Frentz
    fair enough – I will post a review in a few hours — there is a lot of content. Just because you view your military position outside your own countries borders as “ok” does not mean I will “dis friend you”

    The only people I do not call my f…riends are those that cause direct harm to others be-it direct physical contact, verbal or indirect crimes against the environment to a high level.

    I will not call someone my enemy because they have an opinion. That makes you an enlightened, educated, sophisticated human being and someone I enjoy having debates like this one with.

    I have the freedom as a human being NOT AS AN AMERICAN CITIZEN to have the opinion that LARGE AMOUNTS of American military soldiers should only leave our borders to STOP genocide against any living being. Force should not be used for prevention beyond holding small areas for democratic meetings such as Embassy’s and their local protection.

    We deploy troops, they STOP war crimes with the assistance of UN regulation and leadership, then we vacate in accordance with the return of balance and the new local UN approved indigenous leadership.

    Mike Sullivan
    I qualify someone participating in the leaking of classified information as an enemy of the state. What “constitutional guarantee” are you talking about? Freedom of speech? When you become an enemy of the state–you are no longer protected …by the constitution. When freedom of speech–or the exercise of it places you into the category of a spy or collaborator against the government—then yes, this active duty person will consider them an “enemy”.

    Tim Frentz
    Help me understand how this has caused a direct problem to your guys. Send to me as a private message if you would prefer. I am evolving and becoming a better human being by this conversation and the assistance of those involved… except those who call me mean names when I have not done so to them. Corry, I love you to man. come on, lets hug it out. My full apology is coming soon but for now, I AM SORRY I HAVE OFFENDED anyone.

    Loyed Bburn
    Oh, I know Tim what some of us troops have done to walk the longest mile. That was directed at the active duty military member who said he was considering you as an ‘enemy’. I don’t know this person or you very well, I just see what is writ…ten here and that kinda puts the heeby jeebies even on this vets neck hairs. All earthlings are guaranteed voice at birth, true. America has it written into a piece of paper that specifies it as a rule of governing. Governing translates into military power. When the military starts considering voiced Americans as enemies it’s time to pause a moment and ask a few questions. Dig?

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~`
    FULL THREAD:

    Mike Sullivan November 28 at 7:29pm:
    Hell no I won’t browse it. For one, it’s illegal to do so on these government computers–it’ll “classify” the machine and we can lose it. For another, we (anyone without the need to know) have no business looking at classified documents…period. It’s not conspiracy…it’s not censorship…it’s not even “freedom of speech”! It’s a matter of life and death for our soldiers, sailors, marines, and airmen whose names and and very lives are endangered by those documents! If I had my way, I’d assassinate the founder. It’s borderline treason. Think about it…seriously…do you want America’s enemies to look through that information and put Americal lives in danger?! Would you put your social security number online for anyone to see? If not…then how is this any different? Yeah…I’m heated about this and I hope you rethink your position on this.

    Cory Fulton
    Obviously there are things that might put out military personel in danger and our government is trying to protect things not everone should know about. Personally i think we should bomb the hell out of wikileaks for making that stuff public…. Chinese government??? If you dont like it here leave cause there are thousands of men all over the world that are risking their lives everyday for complete dumbasses that think this country “owes” them something. Trade spots with them and maybe you will appreciate the country you live in more.

    So snuggle up to your teddy bear at night and hug your trees during the day and thank wilileaks for putting our military and country in harms way.

    ? November 28 at 7:42pm:
    AMEN
    Mike, I agree with you 95%. classified documents are classified for a reason. This is going to do way more harm than good and people will suffer from it.

    Tim, I’m sorry brother but you DO NOT have a right to know much of this information. And trust me when I tell you that this is not a conspiracy.

    ? November 28 at 7:49pm:
    Also, when does the media have the right to release classified documents? Just because the info was leaked by some little traitor punk in the Army doesn’t give everyone the right to know. This is empowering our enemies! People that want you dead, Tim! People that we in the armed forces are trying to subdue so you can go about voicing your opinions so freely.

    Susie Johnson Conway November 28 at 8:04pm:
    I agree with you B

    Mike Sullivan November 28 at 8:05pm Reply • Report
    Thank you both for your support…glad I’m not alone in my thinking.

    ? November 28 at 8:22pm
    One more thing, Tim. If at any point I thought my government was getting anywhere close to how China runs it’s country and treats it’s people I would be out of the military in a heart beat. You comparing us to them was a huge stretch.

    Claire Schuler November 28 at 8:22pm Reply • Report
    I am hoping that this is all fake and it was just someone with too much time on their hands. My friend’s husband leaves for the war, AGAIN in a few days. I would hate to know that this puts his life in danger

    ? November 28 at 8:28pm Reply • Report
    Claire, his life is always in danger over there. This will just make it worse by giving the bad guys something to feed on and manipulate in there favor. 95% of Afghanis are illiterate… Who do you think will tell them their “version” of these leaks….

    Mike Sullivan
    Just thought about something else. You posted this via Frentz’s Helping Hands…is this the official standpoint of your nonprofit organization or your own? If it’s both…then I can no longer “support” either.

    Tim Frentz 9:13pm
    My family is largely military so my opinions are not coming from the other side of the fence.

    The debate is the content. Provide me a couple links from the site via private message (if you are so convinced you not need to have more people be…come aware of it by pasting on this thread) where you see content that qualifies as life threatening to a soldier alive in a war zone territory that is not currently secure and “safe” in a neutral zone.

    It is a side note, but our internet content is becoming more and more censored every day since the passing of the law to allow unlimited corporate spending on campaigns. It has free’d up companies with the most money to play dirty. They are paying content providers to slow down the websites of their competitors in certain markets which results in errors similar to “website not found” etc.

    There are many examples of this so take 5 minutes and read the following in regards to my censorship comment.

    http://measurementlab.net/resources (this provides scientific data, tools and results etc.)

    http://savetheinternet.com/ (the hub for Internet Freedom / Net Neutrality Forums)

    Spend some time and provide sources to support your opinion please, that is all I ask. I hope to see some examples from you that may convince me to apologize for supporting http://WikiLeaks.org/

    Tim Frentz
    Mike – please wait until we conclude our debate to retract support of our charity. I am not firm on supporting wikiLeaks fully until I am done reading the entire site… which I am trying to do right now.

    So far, it seems like they are just …making the “truth” via documentation available. I try not to support “conspiracy”. I research and look for overwhelming proof before taking a strong stand on anything.

    You rarely EVER see me stand firmly on politics in a debate because I rarely experience their AFFECTS directly on me or someone in my presence. If I do not witness a crime, I can not fully stand on one side or the other and argue.

    As I am reading wikiLeaks, I will post updates and cite examples without republishing “delicate” information that may put a life in jeopardy.

    So start sending me links and help convince me I am wrong….

    Mike Sullivan
    I think you need to prove yourself RIGHT before I have to prove you wrong. My “opinion” comes from 16+ years (and counting) in the military—from my various assignments AROUND the world. I may not like or agree with some things that happen… in the US Government, but I took an oath to support and defend the constitution from all enemies, foreign AND domestic. I am beginning to view you as more of an enemy than a friend. It’s unfortunate that so many of us military people put our lives on the line to defend your right to spew bullshit out of your mouth against us, the government, etc.

    Have you thought that maybe the reason your internet is so slow is because you get it for free?! Maybe it’s due to “cracked” programs you run on your computer? Shall I go ahead and report you to the anti-piracy commision? I “found” all the information I need to report you via the web–wikileaks not needed for that—so because the information is there, that gives me permission to use it against you right? Hmm…think about that for a minute.

    Censorship…what a joke. There is NO censorship in question here. I think you’ve hugged too many trees, Tim…

    Mike Sullivan
    Making “truth” via documentation? Truth? Truth for WHO?! Again…you convince me that you are RIGHT.

    ?
    Tim, are you honestly going to read the 400,000 plus pages that wikileaks is releasing? I think not. The only proof I need is the word of guys I personally know that had to deal with the last leak and all the problems it caused them. And like Mike said, how about you prove to us that this ISN’T going to cause more harm than good. The burden of proof isn’t on us as we didn’t release this crap.

    Cory Fulton
    LMAO! Mike, Ron White said it best, You just can’t fix stupid. Next time Tim maybe you should use common sense before posting something that is very offensive to people who have and are in the military.

    Loyed Bburn
    How can one defend the constitution then declare an American citizen exercising one of their constitutional guarantees as an enemy? Please clarify as I think all American citizens should be aware of an active duty military member who considers free speech to be qualification for ‘enemy’. … just a passerby citizen in this little conversation 🙂

    Tim Frentz
    fair enough – I will post a review in a few hours — there is a lot of content. Just because you view your military position outside your own countries borders as “ok” does not mean I will “dis friend you”

    The only people I do not call my f…riends are those that cause direct harm to others be-it direct physical contact, verbal or indirect crimes against the environment to a high level.

    I will not call someone my enemy because they have an opinion. That makes you an enlightened, educated, sophisticated human being and someone I enjoy having debates like this one with.

    I have the freedom as a human being NOT AS AN AMERICAN CITIZEN to have the opinion that LARGE AMOUNTS of American military soldiers should only leave our borders to STOP genocide against any living being. Force should not be used for prevention beyond holding small areas for democratic meetings such as Embassy’s and their local protection.

    We deploy troops, they STOP war crimes with the assistance of UN regulation and leadership, then we vacate in accordance with the return of balance and the new local UN approved indigenous leadership.

    Mike Sullivan
    I qualify someone participating in the leaking of classified information as an enemy of the state. What “constitutional guarantee” are you talking about? Freedom of speech? When you become an enemy of the state–you are no longer protected …by the constitution. When freedom of speech–or the exercise of it places you into the category of a spy or collaborator against the government—then yes, this active duty person will consider them an “enemy”. Not that I can do anything about it–as it’s my PERSONAL opinion. My opinion does not reflect that of the USAF, the DOD, or US Government.

    Tim Frentz
    Help me understand how this has caused a direct problem to your guys. Send to me as a private message if you would prefer. I am evolving and becoming a better human being by this conversation and the assistance of those involved… except those who call me mean names when I have not done so to them. Corry, I love you to man. come on, lets hug it out. My full apology is coming soon but for now, I AM SORRY I HAVE OFFENDED anyone.

    Loyed Bburn
    Oh, I know Tim what some of us troops have done to walk the longest mile. That was directed at the active duty military member who said he was considering you as an ‘enemy’. I don’t know this person or you very well, I just see what is writ…ten here and that kinda puts the heeby jeebies even on this vets neck hairs. All earthlings are guaranteed voice at birth, true. America has it written into a piece of paper that specifies it as a rule of governing. Governing translates into military power. When the military starts considering voiced Americans as enemies it’s time to pause a moment and ask a few questions. Dig?

    Cory Fulton
    Hug it out?? Sorry Tim I dont support the “Don’t ask, Don’t tell”! Wilileaks might! Research that and update us.

    Loyed Bburn
    lol, so they put it up on the big bad web and all while Santa Clause was takin a smoke break. Toy trucks and carousels, life is grand when ya got a plan 😉

    ?
    No can do Tim, but maybe what I know will come out in the next leak… I look forward to talking to you in person some day.

    TIM FRENTZ
    I was referring to any examples already on the site. I understand your example in mind has not been publicized yet so I want to make it clear to my readers that to the best of your intention and understanding….

    YOU HAVE NOT BROKEN ANY MILITARY CONDUCT as an employee of the United States of America Air Force.

    You should refrain from this conversation at this point so your job and lifestyle is not jeopardized in any way. I know way to many people have lost their job and been discharged for commenting on forum threads such as this for little to no reason at all. Just commenting that you “know some guys who” … may get you reprimanded by your superiors.

    Partly joking but mostly serious. I know you do not intend to make any comments here that get you in trouble but be careful here and anywhere else you may be debating this topic.

    I am sorry I even asked you to provide me sources and to cite the reports with links. Fear is how our soldiers and pawn citizens/politicians are controlled. ONLY completely free people can comment on this debate without worrying about being imprisoned or fired from their livelihood and career.

    I would truely feel bad if you or Mike Sully got in trouble for joining this debate tonight.

  2. amy expatriatus says:

    While I have not followed the rules of debate – not responding to what has been written thusfar, still am writing to say…

    I support Julian Assange and all of the people that have made wikileaks.org possible. All governments must be held accountable for their actions. Wikileaks merely illuminates much of the darkness in today’s political and other systems throughout the world. This particular release of information (not all of which is classified) begs the citizens of this world to look closely at what is important in the greater scheme of things and ask important questions about who we are, how we live and what means are we using to achieve our aims (and really are many of the government’s aims and goals what we ourselves would want for the country.)

    Wikileaks is necessary as the current US government has not only censored the media [gulf oil debacle, iraq & afghanistan military actions/photos] but stripped US citizens of many freedoms through the passage of the patriot act, the Jan 2010 supreme court ruling on the personhood of corporations, illegal military actions/involvement in mid east, TSA radiation generating bodyscanners/physically invasive patdowns for those who opt out, etc.

    Wikileaks current release of documents has the potential to remind the many federal government officials in the US that have forgotten that they are acting representatives of the population and accountable to the people they represent.

    Wikileaks is also acting as a mirror and sometimes when we look in the mirror, we might not like what we see. But that does not mean we need to ignore reality.

    p.s. So many times the phrase collateral damage is thrown around with the idea that all the loses are for the greater good. Then, if this idea is so commonplace now and if this is truly what people think is acceptable then why not look at the leak itself as collateral damage – you could then say wikileaks actions are for the greater good.

  3. one can argue that it can go both ways

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